The Record of Three - Who is the Son? (Part 3 of 6)

Who is the Son?

When God condescends and comes to earth to take on a tabernacle of flesh, he is called the son of God. When God is in Heaven in spirit, glory, and power, He is called the Father. Are there any scriptures where the son of God is in Heaven? Where does God the Father dwell? Is the character of the son of God represented by what God does here on earth? Is the character of the Father represented by the spirit, glory, and power that God has in heaven?

The best explanation I've found on this topic is in Mosiah 15.

And now Abinadi said unto them: I would that ye should understand that God himself shall come down among the children of men, and shall redeem his people. And because he dwelleth in flesh he shall be called the Son of God, and having subjected the flesh to the will of the Father, being the Father and the Son—The Father, because he was conceived by the power of God; and the Son, because of the flesh; thus becoming the Father and Son—And they are one God, yea, the very Eternal Father of heaven and of earth. And thus the flesh becoming subject to the Spirit, or the Son to the Father, being one God, suffereth temptation, and yieldeth not to the temptation, but suffereth himself to be mocked, and scourged, and cast out, and disowned by his people. And after all this, after working many mighty miracles among the children of men, he shall be led, yea, even as Isaiah said, as a sheep before the shearer is dumb, so he opened not his mouth. Yea, even so he shall be led, crucified, and slain, the flesh becoming subject even unto death, the will of the Son being swallowed up in the will of the Father. Mosiah 15:1-7 [emphasis added]

Here are a few more references:

And he said unto me: Behold, the virgin whom thou seest is the mother of the Son of God, after the manner of the flesh. 1 Nephi 11:18 [emphasis added]

Now the Spirit knoweth all things; nevertheless the Son of God suffereth according to the flesh that he might take upon him the sins of his people, that he might blot out their transgressions according to the power of his deliverance; and now behold, this is the testimony which is in me. Alma 7:13 [emphasis added]

Behold, I come unto my own, to fulfil all things which I have made known unto the children of men from the foundation of the world, and to do the will, both of the Father and of the Son—of the Father because of me, and of the Son because of my flesh. And behold, the time is at hand, and this night shall the sign be given. 3 Nephi 1:14 [emphasis added]

In John 14 we read:

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him.

Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us. Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?

Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works. Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father in me: or else believe me for the very works’ sake.

Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father. And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son. If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it. John 14:6-14

What does this means “from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him”? Who dwells inside Jesus's fleshy tabernacle? Does His Holy Spirit or His Holy Ghost dwell inside His fleshy tabernacle? Or is the spirit of another Being dwelling in Him?

When Christ says that no man “comes unto the Father but by [Him]”, this implicitly means that Christ will at some point take you to His Father.

I pray to the Father in the name of the Son. In my mind I think of the Father. I let heaven speak to my heart concerning that name-title and I do not presume to have the right to tell anyone what comes into my mind. I also thank the Father for the sacrifice of His Son.

I would add that “El” is singular. “Elohim” is plural. In Abraham 3, there is a group identified as “the noble and great.” The noble and great are the “we” who are to prove “them.” This is in Abraham 3.

When the matter is settled, in chapter 4 of Abraham, that “we” or “the noble and great” commence the creation, and that group throughout Abraham 4 are continually referred to as “the Gods.” The English term “the Gods” captures the same idea as the Hebrew word “Elohim.”

If you have not read The First Three Words of the Endowment, you may want to do so. ** 

_________________________________________________

It would be an astonishing, but not completely unprecedented, if one of the “sons of God” were to fall away. Were that to happen, the heavens would weep over him.
__________________________________________________

When Christ promised not to leave us “comfortless”, he added that “my Father will love him, and we come unto him, and make our abode with him.” (John 14:23). Joseph Smith added “the appearing of the Father and the Son, in that verse is a personal appearance; and the idea that the Father and the Son dwell in a man’s heart is an old secterian notion, and is false.” (D&C 130: 3).

Joseph affirms he “saw two Personages.”

It is more important that you come unto Christ and you allow Him to teach you these things. Pray to the Father in His name, ask Him, listen to Him. It is Christ alone who is responsible for the salvation of each of us. Read the scriptures carefully. In fact, if you will pray and study your scriptures diligently, He will open up to your mind the meaning of the more mysterious passages and use the words of the Prophets found in our scriptures to answer your questions. Do much more of that. There is no man who is a substitute for Jesus Christ.**

**[There is nothing inconsistent in these two statements. If you can’t understand it, it is because you will not ask and allow God to enlighten your mind. Remember, I am not trying to get you to understand what I understand. I am trying to get you to open your heart, your mind; look to heaven for guidance and get answers to anything you don’t understand.] Denver Snuffer September 21, 2012

Was there anything correct in the idea of a trinity? How did this teaching even get started? Did it come from men attempting to explain the mysteries without understanding them? Why must I look to heaven for guidance? Why is the trinity an incorrect view of God? Denver in speaking of the trinity said,

Christ lost His body of “flesh and bone” in the Council of Nicaea when He became “homoousios” (of one substance with the Father) instead of “homoios” (distinct from, but like the Father). And thus the Son of Man (Mark 14:21; Matt. 26:24; Luke 22:22; John 3:13–among many others), as Christ identified Himself, was transformed by the arguments of men into something altogether “other” from those who descended from Adam. With that development in 325 a.d., the “Trinity” sprang into existence as a fundamental belief of Historic Christianity. This dramatic departure in the definition of God really marks the departure of the original or “Primitive Christianity” from the later “Historic Christianity” which replaced the original.

Fishermen and laborers who saw Christ and testified and described Him as a man, were shunned in favor of the philosophies of men who had not seen Him. But the philosophers controlled Christianity, and could dictate all of its terms.

The newly re-created image was unlike man, thus causing a contradiction between God’s original description of Himself. (Compare Genesis 1:26.) Indeed, how two beings could be one renders Christ “incomprehensible.” This admission was added by another council which adopted the Athanasian Creed, which states in part:

That we worship one God in Trinity, and Trinity in Unity; Neither confounding the persons, nor dividing the substance. For there is one Person of the Father, another of the Son and another of the Holy Spirit. But the Godhead of the Father, of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit is all one, the glory equal, the majesty co-eternal. Such as the Father is, such is the Son and such is the Holy Spirit. The Father uncreated, the Son uncreated, and the Holy Spirit uncreated. The Father incomprehensible, the Son incomprehensible, and the Holy Spirit incomprehensible. The Father eternal, the Son eternal, and the Holy Spirit eternal. And yet they are not three eternals, but one eternal. As also there are not three uncreated nor three incomprehensibles, but one uncreated and one incomprehensible. Denver Snuffer Blog November 22, 2016

Jesus is our Father. Jesus has a Father. His Father, Father Ahman, bears record of Him. Each scripture must be read in context to determine which Father it is being referenced. Denver clarifies that when His Father witnessed it, it did not come from “inside Jesus”.

On the other hand, I do believe in Jesus Christ. Not in the sense that He’s everywhere and nowhere, but that He at one time occupied an actual manger on the evening of His birth. He was baptized in water by John the Baptist in the Jordan River. His Father witnessed it; not from “inside Jesus” because they were comingled; instead the Father (a separate Being occupying a separate location) looked down, saw His Son baptized, and then sent a sign to testify of the Son while speaking in a voice heard by John the Baptist. I believe in Jesus who was crucified, died, was laid to rest in a borrowed tomb, and then rose from the dead. I believe in the man whose body was torn and had the prints of nails in His hands and feet, and who then returned to life. I believe in that Jesus. He showed those hands to 11 surviving Apostles and then to a crowd gathered in the Americas. All of them touched His physical, wounded hands. I believe in Him. Because of my belief in Him, I have done whatever I have come to understand He wanted from me. As a result, I have obtained faith in Him. Moreover, because of the things I have offered in obedience to Him, and by making an acceptable sacrifice, and enduring what others apparently are not willing in this day to endure, I know Him. I know His hands have wounds, His arms are open to welcome those who will come to Him, and He embraces those whom He saves. He is not a God of the dead or the distant, but the God of the Living. Real. Tangible. Resurrected and living now. Denver Snuffer Blog May 9, 2012

The Son stands ready watching for every communication from His Father. The son does the will of the Father.

The Record of Three (Part 1 of 6)

While writing Calleth On My Name, the Lord kept bringing up questions that perplexed me. I would study study study and find an answer to one question only to be presented with other puzzling questions.

I understand why Jesus's disciples would say, “What do these words mean? We do not understand.” Jesus knew that they wanted to ask him to explain what he meant. He said, “Much of what I have said to you may seem like a riddle, but the time will come when you will comprehend my words and they will no longer seem a riddle, and you will understand them plainly.” Testimony of John page 26.

It is almost as if it was written as a riddle on purpose so only those who really want to know will find. I write in the first-person so that as you and I read, it becomes personal for each one of us.

We have been studying 3 Nephi 11 with our family, and I memorized the Doctrine of Christ as one of our mastery scriptures. Why is the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost “bearing record” such a large part of the Doctrine of Christ? Why is this so important? Notice how many times “bear/beareth record” is written in verses 31-41:

Jesus Christ said,

Behold, verily, verily, I say unto you, I will declare unto you my doctrine. And this is my doctrine, and it is the doctrine which the Father hath given unto me; and I bear record of the Father, and the Father beareth record of me, and the Holy Ghost beareth record of the Father and me; and I bear record that the Father commandeth all men, everywhere, to repent and believe in me. And whoso believeth in me, and is baptized, the same shall be saved; and they are they who shall inherit the kingdom of God. And whoso believeth not in me, and is not baptized, shall be damned.

Verily, verily, I say unto you, that this is my doctrine, and I bear record of it from the Father; and whoso believeth in me believeth in the Father also; and unto him will the Father bear record of me, for he will visit him with fire and with the Holy Ghost. And thus will the Father bear record of me, and the Holy Ghost will bear record unto him of the Father and me; for the Father, and I, and the Holy Ghost are one. And again I say unto you, ye must repent, and become as a little child, and be baptized in my name, or ye can in nowise receive these things. And again I say unto you, ye must repent, and be baptized in my name, and become as a little child, or ye can in nowise inherit the kingdom of God.

Verily, verily, I say unto you, that this is my doctrine, and whoso buildeth upon this buildeth upon my rock, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against them. And whoso shall declare more or less than this, and establish it for my doctrine, the same cometh of evil, and is not built upon my rock; but he buildeth upon a sandy foundation, and the gates of hell stand open to receive such when the floods come and the winds beat upon them.

Therefore, go forth unto this people, and declare the words which I have spoken, unto the ends of the earth. 3 Nephi 11:31-41 [emphasis added]

How many times does the Father bear record? Three. How many times does Jesus bear record? Three. But notice the Holy Ghost only bears record twice. I wonder if these details and number of times each member of the Godhead bears record means something?

Three symbolizes whole or complete: “And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures” (Corinthians 15:4) “Which Father, Son, and Holy Ghost are one God, infinite and eternal, without end. Amen.” (Doctrine and Covenants 20:28); the sun, moon, and stars give light to this earth; the telestial, terrestial, and celestial are three degrees of glory; mind, body, and spirit; father, mother, and children make a family; the three witnesses of the Book of Mormon knew of a surety that the work is true; “when three “wo’s” are pronounced upon a people it is a condemnation which will last beyond this life and into eternity” Denver Snuffer Blog March 8, 2010.

I ask, how am I made whole or complete through the Doctrine of Christ? Are the Father and Son whole and complete? Is the Holy Ghost in process of becoming whole and complete? How does the Son bring forth and provide evidence of the Father so He is remembered? How does the Father authenticate evidence of the Son? How can the Holy Ghost let its light shine before the people, that it may bring forth good works and glorify the Father who is in heaven?

Altogether, the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost bears record a total of eight times. The number eight symbolizes a new beginning: we are baptized when we are eight (D&C 68:27), there were eight souls on Noah's ark (Genesis 7:13), the Brother of Jared built eight barges (Ether 3:1), a new week starts on the eighth day, a male child is circumcised on the eighth day (Luke 1:59), Joseph Smith showed the gold plates to eight witnesses. I ask then, how is the Doctrine of Christ a new beginning for me?

What does it mean to bear record?

Bear: To show or exhibit; to relate; to carry, to convey; to withstand something difficult or painful, to support or hold up; sustain, cause to be born, bring forth, provide evidence for.

Record: To cause to be remembered; an authentic account of any facts and proceedings

Why does the Father bear record of Jesus and Jesus bears record of the Father, but they do not bear record of the Holy Ghost, yet the Holy Ghost bears record of the Father and Jesus? What does it mean “the Father, and I, and the Holy Ghost are one”? When these three bear record, what does this mean? Is it binding? Is it an ordinance? Is it noticed and recorded in Heaven?

We see this when Jesus sets forth the manner of baptism and he instructs them to baptize in His name.

Verily I say unto you, that whoso repenteth of his sins through your words, and desireth to be baptized in my name, on this wise shall ye baptize them—

Behold, ye shall go down and stand in the water, and in my name shall ye baptize them. And now behold, these are the words which ye shall say, calling them by name, saying:

Having authority given me of Jesus Christ, I baptize you in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. Amen.

And then shall ye immerse them in the water, and come forth again out of the water.

And after this manner shall ye baptize in my name; for behold, verily I say unto you, that the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Ghost are one; and I am in the Father, and the Father in me, and the Father and I are one. 3 Nephi 11:23-27

What does it mean to baptize in His name? What is His name? To do something in His name, would it need to be done “In the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost”?

Where else have I seen these words before?

Preserving the Restoration by Denver C. Snuffer Jr. begins with the Testimony of Louis Naegle. Louis closes his testimony with these words, “I leave this testimony with you in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost; Amen.” Keith Henderson's testimony is placed at the end of this book. Keith ends his testimony with these words, “In the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. Amen.”

Is this book an ordinance to the gentiles? To the world? What just happened? Did the heavens notice and record something that was almost unnoticed here on earth?

On the night of February 12-13, 2011, I was baptized with fire and the Holy Ghost for the first time. It was in connection with reading excerpts from Denver Snuffer's The Second Comforter Conversing With the Lord Through the Veil. On that night, I knew for myself Denver was giving a truthful testimony. My joy increased until I felt my joy would exceed my mortal strength. It was after this time, that the meaning of scripture began to be unfolded to me in a new and expanded way. There are very few things I claim to know, but this much I do know, Denver Snuffer is telling the truth. For if I would deny this, I would deny the Lord visited me with light from heaven on the night of February 12-13, 2011, and this light filled my soul with exceeding great joy.

I have learned how to distinguish between light and darkness. Light brings joy. Darkness brings misery. Light is comforting yet it is not comfortable. Most often my beliefs and paradigms are challenged and questioned when brought into the light. It takes great strength and focus to stay in the light. Many times it leaves the recipient void of mortal strength (1 Nephi 1:7, Moses 1:9, JSH 1:20). For most it is easier to get distracted and stay in the darkness.

After recognizing the possibility that the testimonies of Louis and Keith sealed an ordinance, I looked at the final page of the The Second Comforter Conversing With the Lord Through the Veil to see if it also closed in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. At first glance it didn't appear to be so, but when I looked at the second to last paragraph, I found these words,

The words of Moroni seem particularly apt as a closing statement: He bids his readers farewell “until we shall meet before the judgment-seat of Christ, where all men shall know that my garments are not spotted with your blood. And then shall ye know that I have seen Jesus, and that he hath talked with me face to face, and that he told me in plain humility, even as a man telleth another in mine own language, concerning these things; And only a few have I written, because of my weakness in writing. And now, I would commend you to seek this Jesus of whom the prophets and apostles have written, that the grace of God the Father, and also the Lord Jesus Christ, and the Holy Ghost, which beareth record of them, may be and abide in you forever. Amen. Ether 12:38-41”[emphasis added]

Here again we find the Father, Jesus Christ, and the Holy Ghost bearing record of these things. Does this mean something? What is happening? Does it put the world on notice when someone with authority in the presence of the Father bears record of those things given him by the Son?

Notice how Oliver Cowdery, David Whitmer, and Martin Harris seal their testimony of the Book of Mormon,

And the honor be to the Father, and to the Son, and to the Holy Ghost, which is one God. Amen.

One might assume Ether 5 is only about the testimony of these three Book of Mormon witnesses. But is this the only application for these words? What is the testimony of three? Which three must bear record of all things?

And in the mouth of three witnesses shall these things be established; and the testimony of three, and this work, in the which shall be shown forth the power of God and also his word, of which the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Ghost bear record—and all this shall stand as a testimony against the world at the last day. Ether 5:4 [emphasis added]

When the Father and the Son and the Holy Ghost bear record, will it stand as binding testimony against the world? “We understand that when a man works by faith he works by mental exertion instead of physical force: it is by words instead of exerting his physical powers, with which every being works when he works by faith” Lectures on Faith 7:3. What power do these words have?

The entire blog post is quite lengthy so I've divided it into different sections. Here are the titles of the next five blog posts.

Who is the Father?

Who is the Son?

Who is the Holy Ghost?

Sons of God

Heavenly Fathers